OT: Mockingly part II

[Sandman]

(spoilers, but whatever, this movie sucks)

(also, long rant)

Part I has been talked about before here in this group, and I just saw part
II yesterday since my kids insisted.

My god what an awful mess of a movie that is. The story and events are either
all over the place or there are scenes when people are sitting still talking
and talking and talking... Or Katniss wakes up in a hospital bed. The movie
is over two hours long and there is just two scenes in it where something
actually happens.

And Jennifer Lawrence... Man, you're a GOOD actor! Why do you have only one
facial expression during the entire movie and the emotional range of an old
sock?

At one point she has a gun to her head, with the assailant asking why he
should shoot her, and she talks for like five hours without moving a single
muscle in her face... This is some Kirsten Stewart level of non-acting.

I complained about part I quite a lot, and someone here said that the next
part would be more eventful since it would be "war". But where is the war?
The first assault by District 13 is on District 2, it is viewed from afar
while Katniss and Gale stands... and... talks... Bleh. So that's another non-
scene which had nothing to do with progressing the story.

Then the supposed "war" is put on hold to the very end of the film when bombs
are dropped on civilians, and that's it.

And the scenes that are supposed to be emotional are just confusing. Bombs
are dropped, then Katniss stands up and sees Prim for about a second, then
another bomb drops and kills her... But it's set up in such a moronic fashion
that you're not sure if it's a dream or a vision or what it's supposed to be,
you're just sitting there thinking "how the hell did hr sister get in to the
capital as medical personell in like five minutes?"

And even more stupidities, after the supposed "war" Katniss is strolling
around in what I assume is Snow's mansion, sees a greenhouse and walks
towards it, guards stop her and whatsherface says she can go in because
anything inside belongs to her anyway... What's inside? Flowers... Is it
graves? Maybe, but then suddenly *Snow* is there. The guy that is supposed to
be her mortal enemy is just there strolling around amongst the flowers (or
graves? dunno) and talks to her. The guy that wanted her dead, the guy she
wanted to kill for ages, just walks around there.

So presumably it wasn't graves, at least not graves important to Katniss?
We're led to believe that after taking the capital, the rebels confined Snow
to.. a greenhouse? With two guards? And Katniss didn't know, and she wanted
to go to the greenhouse..why? And the guard are just outside looking in
waiting for...what? And whatsherface said everything in there belongs to
her...why?

And the second of the two action scenes in this 2 hour snooze fest has a
lead-up of a party of like ten people walking slowly in dark tunnels, then a
million Mutts attack and it's a frenzy of cut-shots that shows exactly
nothing and at the end you don't know who died and who survived. And since
90% of the squad are expandable characters you don't care about it either
way. It's so stereotypically set up. Before there is a small short scene
where the Avox's brother talks a bit, and you know 100% that it's a setup for
one of them dying, but it's a crap setup, you can't make us emotionally
attached to a character five minutes before he dies, we don't care.

Finicky dies as well, but I hardly remember him at all, so I don't care about
him either.

The one that we *do* have an emotional connection with is Primrose, and her
death is a swift "whatever" of a confusing mess.

All of this just reinforces the fact that when adapting a book to a movie,
sacrifices need to be made, characters need to be removed, personality traits
need to be combined into other characters, roles need to be absorbed. A movie
series that spans four movies can't have 20 characters about which life and
death we are supposed to care about.

Take Game of Thrones as a prime example. People die left and right both in
the books and in the series, but there are only a handful deaths that we do
care about, about which the story and character development is heavily
centered around. Ned Stark, Robb Stark, Jon Snow etc.

Anyway, rant over. Shit movie, shit series.

[JJ]

Post by Sandman
(spoilers, but whatever, this movie sucks)
(also, long rant)
Part I has been talked about before here in this group, and I just saw part
II yesterday since my kids insisted.
My god what an awful mess of a movie that is. The story and events are either
all over the place or there are scenes when people are sitting still talking
and talking and talking... Or Katniss wakes up in a hospital bed. The movie
is over two hours long and there is just two scenes in it where something
actually happens.
And Jennifer Lawrence... Man, you're a GOOD actor! Why do you have only one
facial expression during the entire movie and the emotional range of an old
sock?
At one point she has a gun to her head, with the assailant asking why he
should shoot her, and she talks for like five hours without moving a single
muscle in her face... This is some Kirsten Stewart level of non-acting.
I complained about part I quite a lot, and someone here said that the next
part would be more eventful since it would be "war". But where is the war?
The first assault by District 13 is on District 2, it is viewed from afar
while Katniss and Gale stands... and... talks... Bleh. So that's another non-
scene which had nothing to do with progressing the story.
Then the supposed "war" is put on hold to the very end of the film when bombs
are dropped on civilians, and that's it.
And the scenes that are supposed to be emotional are just confusing. Bombs
are dropped, then Katniss stands up and sees Prim for about a second, then
another bomb drops and kills her... But it's set up in such a moronic fashion
that you're not sure if it's a dream or a vision or what it's supposed to be,
you're just sitting there thinking "how the hell did hr sister get in to the
capital as medical personell in like five minutes?"
And even more stupidities, after the supposed "war" Katniss is strolling
around in what I assume is Snow's mansion, sees a greenhouse and walks
towards it, guards stop her and whatsherface says she can go in because
anything inside belongs to her anyway... What's inside? Flowers... Is it
graves? Maybe, but then suddenly *Snow* is there. The guy that is supposed to
be her mortal enemy is just there strolling around amongst the flowers (or
graves? dunno) and talks to her. The guy that wanted her dead, the guy she
wanted to kill for ages, just walks around there.
So presumably it wasn't graves, at least not graves important to Katniss?
We're led to believe that after taking the capital, the rebels confined Snow
to.. a greenhouse? With two guards? And Katniss didn't know, and she wanted
to go to the greenhouse..why? And the guard are just outside looking in
waiting for...what? And whatsherface said everything in there belongs to
her...why?
And the second of the two action scenes in this 2 hour snooze fest has a
lead-up of a party of like ten people walking slowly in dark tunnels, then a
million Mutts attack and it's a frenzy of cut-shots that shows exactly
nothing and at the end you don't know who died and who survived. And since
90% of the squad are expandable characters you don't care about it either
way. It's so stereotypically set up. Before there is a small short scene
where the Avox's brother talks a bit, and you know 100% that it's a setup for
one of them dying, but it's a crap setup, you can't make us emotionally
attached to a character five minutes before he dies, we don't care.
Finicky dies as well, but I hardly remember him at all, so I don't care about
him either.
The one that we *do* have an emotional connection with is Primrose, and her
death is a swift "whatever" of a confusing mess.
All of this just reinforces the fact that when adapting a book to a movie,
sacrifices need to be made, characters need to be removed, personality traits
need to be combined into other characters, roles need to be absorbed. A movie
series that spans four movies can't have 20 characters about which life and
death we are supposed to care about.
Take Game of Thrones as a prime example. People die left and right both in
the books and in the series, but there are only a handful deaths that we do
care about, about which the story and character development is heavily
centered around. Ned Stark, Robb Stark, Jon Snow etc.
Anyway, rant over. Shit movie, shit series.
--
Sandman

So I take it that you didn't like it? :oO

[Sandman]

Post by JJ

(spoilers, but whatever, this movie sucks) (also, long rant) Part
I has been talked about before here in this group, and I just saw
part II yesterday since my kids insisted. My god what an awful
mess of a movie that is. The story and events are either all over
the place or there are scenes when people are sitting still
talking and talking and talking... Or Katniss wakes up in a
hospital bed. The movie is over two hours long and there is just
two scenes in it where something actually happens. And Jennifer
Lawrence... Man, you're a GOOD actor! Why do you have only one
facial expression during the entire movie and the emotional range
of an old sock? At one point she has a gun to her head, with the
assailant asking why he should shoot her, and she talks for like
five hours without moving a single muscle in her face... This is
some Kirsten Stewart level of non-acting. I complained about part
I quite a lot, and someone here said that the next part would be
more eventful since it would be "war". But where is the war? The
first assault by District 13 is on District 2, it is viewed from
afar while Katniss and Gale stands... and... talks... Bleh. So
that's another non- scene which had nothing to do with progressing
the story. Then the supposed "war" is put on hold to the very end
of the film when bombs are dropped on civilians, and that's it.
And the scenes that are supposed to be emotional are just
confusing. Bombs are dropped, then Katniss stands up and sees Prim
for about a second, then another bomb drops and kills her... But
it's set up in such a moronic fashion that you're not sure if it's
a dream or a vision or what it's supposed to be, you're just
sitting there thinking "how the hell did hr sister get in to the
capital as medical personell in like five minutes?" And even more
stupidities, after the supposed "war" Katniss is strolling around
in what I assume is Snow's mansion, sees a greenhouse and walks
towards it, guards stop her and whatsherface says she can go in
because anything inside belongs to her anyway... What's inside?
Flowers... Is it graves? Maybe, but then suddenly *Snow* is there.
The guy that is supposed to be her mortal enemy is just there
strolling around amongst the flowers (or graves? dunno) and talks
to her. The guy that wanted her dead, the guy she wanted to kill
for ages, just walks around there. So presumably it wasn't graves,
at least not graves important to Katniss? We're led to believe
that after taking the capital, the rebels confined Snow to.. a
greenhouse? With two guards? And Katniss didn't know, and she
wanted to go to the greenhouse..why? And the guard are just
outside looking in waiting for...what? And whatsherface said
everything in there belongs to her...why? And the second of the
two action scenes in this 2 hour snooze fest has a lead-up of a
party of like ten people walking slowly in dark tunnels, then a
million Mutts attack and it's a frenzy of cut-shots that shows
exactly nothing and at the end you don't know who died and who
survived. And since 90% of the squad are expandable characters you
don't care about it either way. It's so stereotypically set up.
Before there is a small short scene where the Avox's brother talks
a bit, and you know 100% that it's a setup for one of them dying,
but it's a crap setup, you can't make us emotionally attached to a
character five minutes before he dies, we don't care. Finicky dies
as well, but I hardly remember him at all, so I don't care about
him either. The one that we *do* have an emotional connection with
is Primrose, and her death is a swift "whatever" of a confusing
mess. All of this just reinforces the fact that when adapting a
book to a movie, sacrifices need to be made, characters need to be
removed, personality traits need to be combined into other
characters, roles need to be absorbed. A movie series that spans
four movies can't have 20 characters about which life and death we
are supposed to care about. Take Game of Thrones as a prime
example. People die left and right both in the books and in the
series, but there are only a handful deaths that we do care about,
about which the story and character development is heavily
centered around. Ned Stark, Robb Stark, Jon Snow etc. Anyway, rant
over. Shit movie, shit series. -- Sandman

So I take it that you didn't like it? :oO

I give it a solid 5/7 :)

[Paul S. Person]

Post by Sandman
(spoilers, but whatever, this movie sucks)
(also, long rant)
Part I has been talked about before here in this group, and I just saw part
II yesterday since my kids insisted.

I saw it when it came out, but it took a week to decompress and so I
never bothered posting it, figuring that, by then, those who wanted to
see it (or whose kids dragged them to see it) would have seen it.

I appear to be living in a retail DVD desert, so it may be a while
before I see it again. My memory of it is not firm enough to allow me
to say anything about the /film/. My memory of my initial reaction was
that the film was stuffed with things from the book -- a veritable
paradise for the book's readers who want to see as much of it as
possible on-screen. The only "filler" in the sense of scenes not in
the book, given some of the changes made and sequences omitted, is, as
usual, the scenes where Katniss is /not/ present.

Yes, that means that there is still /more in the book/ than made it
into the film -- even with a fairly short book and two movies!

Many readers complained that the third book read as if the author
wanted to get it over with as soon as possible, and many felt that it
should have been done as two books. Some of these changed their minds
on re-reading the book.

Some readers also complained that Katniss was less communicative in
the third book, a large part of what gives the impression of a lack of
depth compared to the first two. I pointed out some time ago that that
is what happens when you have a character tell a story who is shutting
down psychologically.

I will have to see the film again before reaching any conclusions on
how well it works as a movie.

As to "war story", this depends on how that is defined. /The Hunger
Games/, taken as a whole (all three books/four films) is the same sort
of "war story" as /Born on the Fourth of July/ was. If that is outside
your definition of "war story", then so be it.

[Paul S. Person]

On Fri, 25 Mar 2016 10:39:05 -0700, Paul S. Person

Post by Paul S. Person

Post by Sandman
(spoilers, but whatever, this movie sucks)
(also, long rant)
Part I has been talked about before here in this group, and I just saw part
II yesterday since my kids insisted.

I saw it when it came out, but it took a week to decompress and so I
never bothered posting it, figuring that, by then, those who wanted to
see it (or whose kids dragged them to see it) would have seen it.

<snippo DVD retail desert>

Post by Paul S. Person
Yes, that means that there is still /more in the book/ than made it
into the film -- even with a fairly short book and two movies!
Many readers complained that the third book read as if the author
wanted to get it over with as soon as possible, and many felt that it
should have been done as two books. Some of these changed their minds
on re-reading the book.
Some readers also complained that Katniss was less communicative in
the third book, a large part of what gives the impression of a lack of
depth compared to the first two. I pointed out some time ago that that
is what happens when you have a character tell a story who is shutting
down psychologically.
I will have to see the film again before reaching any conclusions on
how well it works as a movie.

I finally got it and saw it again. FWIW, this is a brief update:

1. There is more in it than I remembered. Major parts of the book are
still missing; but more of the details made it in than I noticed the
first time.
2. Katniss does show emotions, but they are quite subdued and
invariably not pleasant -- fear, dispair, hopelessness and (the only
positive one) determination. The reasons given above still apply.
3. Many reviewers have complained about "lack of expression", not just
the OP. I can think of three possible explanations, neither of which
may apply:
a) Some people simple can't read really subtle emotions.
b) Some people expect movies to only use exaggerated emotional
expressions, so as to make it clear what is going on.
c) Some people simply don't want to watch a story about a teenage
girl who starts out psychologically damaged with a family history of
mental illness and goes downhill from there.

I found it a lot less "busy" this time, but I can certainly understand
why others might have felt that it had too much from the book in it.

Last year, a minor discussion occurred regarding other YA films. I
have a few observations on those I have seen:

1. Many of them are, to me, no more worthwhile than most non-YA films
are.
2. The /Divergent/ series appears (after watching /Insurgent/ and the
trailers for the first half of the third book's two films) to be an
expanded version of the same story told by such films (in a single
film) as /The Giver/, /Logan's Run/, and /THX 1138/. I take it that
the films are following the books, so I see no need to use such words
as "padding" or "filler". I will see the third and fourth films in due
course.
3. Something odd happened with /The Maze Runner/: the Maze, which
looked quite impressive in the trailers, was much less so in the film.
Still, I will be renting the second level of what I presume (since it
has levels) of being some sort of video game when I get to it; and,
who knows, perhaps even the dorky acronym "WCKD" will make sense,
inside the film. I plan to keep up with this series as well.

"WCKD" as an acronym for the bad guys (who may well turn out to be the
good guys, in this sort of story that is actually quite likely) is
/not/ the most dorky terminology in living memory -- the use of "GI
Joe" for a secret elite military force has that honor (or dishonor,
depending on your point of view).

Also, to be clear, these pretty much all appear to be well-made films,
as do the Marvel films. But many of them are lacking in interest for
various reasons, just as the Marvel films ultimately fail (/Ant-Man/
might have made the cut -- if it hadn't been tied into the Avengers),
most commonly by relying of CGI to carry the story, although really
idiotic (IMHO) characterization also plays a part. Much the same can
be said of the Tranformer's series.

BTW, if you are one of those who wish you could actually /see/ a
Transformer transform (as opposed to seeing bits and pieces), allow me
to remind you that the Mel Brook's film /Spaceballs/ does exactly
that. It really isn't that hard a thing to show.